whoah whoah there you did not just diss miyazaki.

also, lucky star doesn’t have particularly good animation, save a couple of scenes. The series with the most experienced animators this season are Denno Coil and Gurren Lagann.

I love Miyazaki’s work I really do. The production quality on his projects are usually 100% up and above any OVA or TV series and to some extent all other anime movies. As for the entertainment value I believe its way up there too, perhaps not as much as the wow factor associated with technical aspects, but still great nonetheless. I mean you must’ve muttered an OMG the second the main character in Howling Castle turned into an old woman…when was the last time we saw that happening unless you’ve read the summary or something. I guess its a matter of taste.

Personally, I love MIyazaki’s work (Howl’s Moving Castle excepted). He is at his best when he focuses mostly on atmosphere and character, which is why my favorite movies of his (Kiki’s Delivery Service, Porco Rosso) tend not to be plot driven. Lately he seems to be trying to pile on the weirdness and surrealism, which worked all right in Spirited Away and failed in Howl.

As I mentioned in my post–thanks for the plug :)–the parts of Dennou Coil that are Miyazakiesque are almost all drawn from Totoro, which is probably his most successfully atmospheric films. I read one critic who said that this is what childhood memory feels like, if you had a relatively happy childhood. That I think is what Miyazaki does at this best.

Miyazaki’s a hit-and-miss affair for me. I find its brand loyalty to be disgusting. Spirited Away did little more than bore me, especially with completely random moments like the hairband near the end. Why is that even there? It didn’t serve any purpose but to waste time.

Howl’s was marginally better, but it lacked exposition on a lot of the background. Like the war — where did it come from? Who’s been doing what? Oh wait, Howl is the key to solving all our problems. Yay. Sorry, not good enough.

I think after Princess Mononoke, Miyazaki lost his touch. Mononoke really touched me, and remains one of my favourite anime movies. But it kept things simple. No huge political backdrop no one can understand, no complex metaphysics. Totoro was all right as well, and yet it just never really jumped out at me as a “great” work. Mononoke is a “great” work, Totoro is just good.

Miyazaki’s epic of course is Nausicaa, which I absolutely love and adore in manga form, but can’t seem to appreciate as an anime. It’s too compressed, left without a proper conclusion, etc. Granted, Nausicaa’s iconoclastic ending sours me in general, but at least it HAS a ending. The anime just kinda falls short.

The cult of Miyazaki’s really a bugger these days. It’s like you can’t say anything bad about him, thanks to the great unwashed who have no taste and no standards.

[...] It’s like Mizayaki decided to stop churning out the same old boring crap I don’t have any real issues with Hayao Miyazaki’s work for the record, they’re pieces of art blah […] [...]

Miyazaki made his greatest statements with his earlier films like Nausicaa, Laputa, Kiki’s, Totoro and Porco Roso. The later films perhaps don’t have the same impact because he’s really just been revisiting many of the same themes he has dealt with earlier, albeit with technically improved animation. Mononoke Hime, for instance, was in many ways a remake of Nausicaa (Actually, I prefer it to Nausicaa). You might want to see more of the earlier films of Miyazaki before making sweeping judgments about his work. As for Totoro, keep in mind that its intended to be a fairly simple story, not designed to really dazzle the audience in the way of Spirited Away or Howl’s, but rather to evoke a certain spirit of the wonder of childhood.

After seeing the comments, I thought it best to refrain from discussing Miyazaki here, although I wanted at first.

One observation I still want to make is that all screenshots I saw for Dennou Coli were ugly, low-quality work, with poor character art right from B-list anime of 1988. This includes the “magnanimous” link above. Designs themselves often look deformed. All confining lines are unsteady and seem like a webcomic. Proper shading is absent: just look the jawline (it can be found in the ears, but only sometimes). It’s just horrifying. Obviously I’m missing something that screenshots alone cannot transmit.

Asuka: I assume if you’d judged me from an entry about Kodomo no Jikan you’d say I’m a paedophile lolicon addict, right? Wait, that would mean I do appreciate innocence, just not in the way that you’d expect me to. Just sayin’. Also, cocks.

I thought I made it clear I didn’t watch enough of Miyazaki to give an elaborate opinion about it. Trying to fake an opinion about someone as prolific and renowned as him makes me a poser, and I don’t see why you’d want that.

Author: lol ok. Tell me when you get around to actually seeing the show instead of judging it from lossy .jpg screenshots optimised for websites. Maybe you’ll see things better then.

For the record, I’m Malaysian, and it’s damn amusing to note how apparently only people living in a particular country can have an opinion on the internet? Sorry I’m not living up to the meek, subservient Asian figure ideal, go get your stereotype fix somewhere else.

Oh man, you better move to the States now Owen!

“I thought I made it clear I didn�t watch enough of Miyazaki to give an elaborate opinion about it.”

I do appreciate your honesty and not-trying-to-be-a-poser. But on the flip side of the coin, insufficient exposure to Miyazaki also means that you have no right to put him down. It’s your attitude of looking down on a popular name without experiencing enough of his works that makes you sound like a spoiled American teenager. And FYI, I knew you weren’t an American. You’re also not a teenager, for that matter. I’m just LIKING you to an American teenager based on your mindset.

Why you work so hard to defy the “meek, subservient Asian figure ideal” is another thing. Please, enlighten me with your traumatic past that has made you the way you are.

Look Owen, you have not justified why you don’t like Miyazaki’s works, despite watching 3 movies of his. All you said was “I don’t find his stuff entertaining.. like not /entertaining/ entertaining”. What am I (and your other respected readers) supposed to make of that? You did a great job of explaining what aspects of Dennou Coil you liked, but what about the 3 Miyazaki movies you’ve watched? Why was Miyazaki’s movies inferior in comparison? Why weren’t they “great” in your book? You’ve failed to outline the fundamentals before going out of your way to diss a respectable director, and that I find very immature.

You’re right - the average teen wouldn’t go out of his/her way to dissect both perspectives before contrasting them, and the fact that you haven’t either makes you not at all different from them.

Plus, I didn’t say you have to watch ALL of Miyazaki’s movies before forming an opinion about him. You yourself admitted that you didn’t watch a SUFFICIENT amount to make a justification. But yet, you seem to praise the fact that you’ve seen 3 of his movies. Are you bragging or being humble?

In regards to your comment about innocence, I agree - if you’re into lolicon then technically you are “appreciating innocence”. But I forgot to specify - I was talking about a platonic appreciation, whereas you would like little boys/girls for sexual reasons. In any case, it was wrong of me to stereotype you based on a single entry of yours, and I apologize. However, this does not retract from the fact that you were also incredibly immature with both this post and some of your comments.

Lastly, I don’t mind that you dislike something I like, provided that you give specific reasons. Your post failed to do that, and without proper justification your opinions lose credibility. I’m not saying that you’re working hard to “create” an opinion, per se, but I question your motive behind blatantly voicing such half-developed opinions. To generate controversy? To leave an impression? Whatever it may be. To think that my “bad sarcasm” prompted such a heated defense from you says really a lot about your ego.

Haha, this reminds me of when I tell people I hate Miyazaki. A lot of them want specifics, meaning I’d probably have to rewatch it to get all the shit down that I hated.

It’s the same deal with Gundam. You say you hate Gundam and the questions start coming like a rain of fire. “What Gundams have you even seen? Well what did you dislike about them? That’s not a valid reason. Gundam is genius.” I get it allll the time. Luckily my smarter online buddies, like wildarmsheero, can come to an agreement that, for whatever reason, we sometimes disagree on which shows are good or to what degree they are good. THEM’S HOW IT IS! Gundam sucks.

Theatrical anime seems to have a thing for surrealism, and not just in Miyazaki’s work (I caught a Canadian opening night showing of Paprika on Friday). I find it really hard to judge surreal movies… the imagery is usually fantastic, but how can one form an opinion of a storyline that follows its own logic? Is saying it didn’t make sense a valid complaint if it’s meant not to?

For the record, I find I like most surreal anime to some extent, but with the exception of Spirited Away not to the extent I like my favourite series (stuff like Zipang, Haruhi, Iriya, etc.). And I simply cannot justify that position because it’s pretty hard to argue logically about an illogical show!

It seems like I was the only person not impressed by episode 1 of Coil… possibly because the way the virtual blended with the real didn’t seem that plausible for me (I’m the kind of guy who groans at hacking scenes in movies/TV). I still plan to give the next few episodes a go, though, because I figure it’s best not to just on merely one episode.

Outf0xzero:
I think you should sharpen the line separating surrealism from surrealist imagery. And maybe stick a little note on there that clearly defines absurdism.

Basically, my point is as follow: Absurdism has no discernible structure and would be really hard to comment on outside of the overall genre. Your examples here will be shows where one thing doesn’t follow from the other or generally fit into the overall world makeup. Excel Saga is a good ol’ example of this sort of thing as entirely absurd, and possibly sometimes surreal, things occur. For instance, we expect a punch to wound something, not for the thing to make an ugly face and explode.

As for surrealism, it’s more of a situational thing, I think. Like, you can have normal people… BUT MAYBE THEY TALK BACKWARDS!! IN RIDDLES!! You know, that sort of thing. Still, it applies to an overall story sort of thing. FOr instance, in Paprika, things are surreal, but not absurd. They step outside of our expectations of reality, while still sort of conforming to their own rules.

And a lot of times, the surrealism just comes down to relatively normal things that just happen to look surreal. Sen to Chihiro no kamikakushi is a sort of good example of surrealist imagery to me. And maybe I am just nitpicking for the sake of my comment here, but really what you have is a normally functioning city, and lots of normal acting people who just look very surreal by human standards. They still, by and large, conform to the actions we’d expect of the similar character in human form.

I forgot where I was going with this… I think I’m done, but I’m not sure.

“Argument from personal incredulity. All because you don�t believe it�s possible doesn�t mean it�s not true.”

I don’t have a fancy Latin word for this, but you’re committing what I call “putting your words in my mouth”. I never said I don’t believe your claim. I’m saying it’s unacceptable for you to use this weak claim for defense. Since you’re such a grammar/logic police, be careful not to fall into your own dug hole.

“False analogy. Eating is not the same as watching anime. Good job!”

Sure, the sensory pathways of vision and taste are very different, but we’re talking about memory formation here - both visual and taste information are committed to memory by the same mechanism called Long Term Potentiation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long-term_potentiation). Both types of information are encoded into memory and withdrawn from the memory pool in the same way. If I can recall why I didn’t prefer McDonald’s, I can do the same with an anime. The analogy holds.

“Fallacy of four terms. How does �a contrast� somehow turn into �praise� here?”

No no, it’s more like:

R1: Teenagers only watch one movie before forming a biased opinion
R2: Owen actually watches three Miyazaki movies before forming an opinion
Comparison: Owen has more exposure to the Miyazaki, allowing him to make a fairer judgment about the director than the average teenager.

Why isn’t “fairer judgment” a praise?

“Equivocation. Check again. While you�re at it, hand me the number of your local police station, because I�d like to report you for murdering the English language.”

Equivocation is the misleading use of a word with different meanings. “A lot better” does not have different meanings. Therefore “A lot better” is not an equivocation. To dissect the phrase for your enjoyment, “better” means “of superior quality”, and “a lot” is just an adverb that amplifies “better”. There is no other meaning to “a lot better”. Thanks for the hyperbole, by the way.

“Post hoc ergo propter hoc. You assume I�ve been sleeping early for the past few days, because that�s clearly what I�ve been doing, right? Or are you going to say that�s a fact, too?”

Hiding the fact that you’ve actually stayed up later than usual to write a reply? If you’ve always slept at around 6 a.m., then there would be no significance in mentioning the time in your post. “It’s time for me to go to bed” would be sufficient. Since you’ve highlighted the time for emphasis, it must have been outside of your usual routine. So Professor Owen, any other defense mechanisms up your sleeve?

“Are you done with your faulty reasoning here? You have one continue left.”

If you see any other faults with my reasoning, please elaborate on them. I do appreciate the big word + sarcastic remark format of your replies, and it does make you look like you know what you’re saying, but too bad those words do not accurately apply to my statements at all. Keep working at it.

[...] Coil is something I’ve picked up on account of Owen’s ranting about it. I had my reservations on picking up a second series alongside Lucky Star (my schedule allows for [...]

Can I have some of that popcorn you’re having?

Owen, damn you. Five days of no internet, and I come here seeing this.

[...] More Miyazaki Merging Published June 25th, 2007 fanboy spiel , kamichu , musings This post about how Dennou Coil evokes Hayao Miyazaki (which I agree with wholeheartedly) reminded me of when [...]